Category Archives: Crucifixion

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This is a forum for understanding of Christianity, through Bible and teachings of Jesus Christ. It is well known that the Moses and Jesus Christ did not speak English or Greek, the present day English Bibles are translations of translations  by many unknown scribes during past hundred of years, while the original books of Bible are non extant. Analysis of the teachings of Jesus Christ as available in the four Gospels, does not directly support the doctrines of Christianity, which are based upon theology of Paul of Tarsus and later Church fathers. [Video]

Jesus Christ obeyed & worshiped One God and preached the same.

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Image result for monotheism

So question arises;

What should be done by a simple person who believes in God, wants to obey Him,  seek eternal bliss and salvation?
Its very simple, if someone is seriously  sick, he/she shall search for a credible doctor and if any stage it is found that he is fake, unreliable, immediately treatment is discontinued, one looks for batter one. God has given us wisdom and intellect to discern truth from falsehood. We spend years in education and learning to earn livelihood and respectable life. We have to make some effort to discover and earn eternal life, blessings and spiritual peace.
Take a bath, wear clean cloths, sit down alone and pray to God: “O, God of the universe, You are the Creator, Cherishes of all, You are Gracious and Merciful, I want to follow the right path which is pleasing to You, please help me, guide me to the Truth. Amen.
  1. Free your mind of all your existing beliefs & ideas.
  2. If you are a Christian, take Red or Blue lettered Gospels”, pen , marker and papers. Start reading Gospels, slowly, gradually, take your time, don’t be in hurry.
  3. Underline, highlight, note down the teachings, sayings of Jesus Christ what he physically and openly preached to people and 12 disciples, not in “VISIONS or Dreams”. [Thomas Jefferson’s Experience]
  4. Discard what is not common in four Gospels. Critically examine it, accept what is clear, obvious your are near to the Truth, discard any belief which is ambiguous, not clearly , openly preached by Jesus Christ.
  5. Look around for people who you find practicing closer to the real teachings of Jesus Christ. Seek their assistance.
  6. Continue with your quest for Truth till you find it. Keep praying to God for His help. Onus lies with Him.
  7. Keep exploring, keep reading ………. This site will assist in this regards.

“You will seek Me and find Me when you search for Me with all your heart” (Jeremiah 29:13)

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While the Basic concept of Bible remains monotheistic [Deuteronomy;6:4-5, Psalms;14:1, 116:5Job;23:8-9, Exodus; 9:14, 34:6-7, Psalms;, 2Samuel;7:22, Isaiah;46:5,9, Matthew;19:17-19, Mark;12:29-31, Romans;1:25]; some passages are interpreted to support Christian Church doctrines. One message is clear:
Jesus answered, “The greatest is, ‘Hear, Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one: you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind, and with all your strength.’ This is the first commandment. The second is like this, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.[Mark 12:29-31]

The Bible itself and the scholars agree that the present text is not as was originally revealed:
“How do you say, We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us? Lo, certainly he made it falsely; the pen of the scribes made it a lie.”[Jeremiah 8:8]. 
“Woe unto them that decree unrighteous decrees, and that write misfortune which they have prescribed; To turn aside the needy from justice, and to take away the right from the poor of my people, that widows may be their prey, and that they may rob the fatherless!”[Isaiah 10:1-2]

Extracts from ‘Preface’ to RSV Bible approved by The National Council of the Churches of Christ in the USA reproduced below also confirms the same:
‘The King James Version of the New Testament was based upon a Greek text that was marred by mistakes, containing the accumulated errors of fourteen centuries of manuscript copying.’
‘Sometimes it is evident that the text has suffered in transmission, but none of the versions provides a satisfactory restoration.’
‘Yet the King James Version has grave defects. By the middle of the nineteenth century, the development of Biblical studies and the discovery of many manu­scripts more ancient than those upon which the King James Version was based, made it manifest that these defects are so many and so serious as to call for revision of the English translation.’  

‘Sometimes the present translation will be found to render a Hebrew word in a sense quite different from that of the traditional interpretation.’
‘Many difficulties and obscurities, of course, remain.’
‘We now possess many more ancient manuscripts of the New Testament, and are far better equipped to seek to recover the original wording of the Greek text’
 
The scholars are continuously trying to improve and to make the Biblical text as closer to the ‘visualised original’ as possible but the task is  not only arduous but impossible due to non existence of original scripts. Under these circumstances it is the individual responsibility to find out truth as Jesus Christ urged his followers to use the reason and intellect to discern the truth from falsehood:

“He also said to the multitudes, “When you see a cloud rising in the west, you say at once, ‘A shower is coming’; and so it happens. And when you see the south wind blowing, you say, ‘There will be scorching heat’; and it happens. You hypocrites! You know how to interpret the appearance of earth and sky; but why do you not know how to interpret the present time? “And why do you not judge for yourselves what is right?” [Luke;12:54-56]

It is aimed to facilitate efforts of knowledge seekers to discern the truth from falsehood with the intellectual use of available evidence with in Bible and history. Every one is entitled to his belief but one has to be sure that its based upon the real teachings not derived human work, which may result in everlasting doom & destruction:
“The soul that sins shall die. The son shall not suffer for the iniquity of the father, nor the father suffer for the iniquity of the son; the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself. But if a wicked man turns away from all his sins which he has committed and keeps all my statutes and does what is lawful and right, he shall surely live; he shall not die.”(Ezekiel;18:20-21)
“The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin.” (Deuteronomy 24:16, 2Kings 14:6)
“In those days they shall say no more, The fathers have eaten a sour grape, and the children’s teeth are set on edge. But every one shall die for his own iniquity: every man that eateth the sour grape, his teeth shall be set on edge.” (Jeremiah 31:29-30)
“Say ye to the righteous, that it shall be well with him: for they shall eat the fruit of their doings. Woe unto the wicked! it shall be ill with him: for the reward of his hands shall be given him.” (Isaiah 3:10-11)
“For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.” (Matthew 16:27 )

There may be some other verses with conflicting meanings, in such a situation one has to apply his/her intellect to discern truth from false in the light of saying of Jesus Christ; “And why do you not judge for yourselves what is right?” [Luke;12:56]. Remember;“God is not the author of confusion…” (1 Corinthians 14:33). It is simple and logical that a son can not be punished for the crime of his father or any one else, so any doctrine which deviates from the simple logic and clear Biblical text does not stand up to the criteria.
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Conclusion
How do you say, We are wise, and the law of the LORD is with us? Lo, certainly he made it falsely; the pen of the scribes made it a lie [Jeremiah 8:8]
Woe unto them that decree unrighteous decrees, and that write misfortune which they have prescribed; To turn aside the needy from justice, and to take away the right from the poor of my people, that widows may be their prey, and that they may rob the fatherless! [Isaiah 10:1-2]
So question arises that:
What should be done by a simple person who believes in God, wants to obey Him,  seek eternal bliss and salvation?
Its very simple, if someone is seriously  sick, he/she shall search for a credible doctor and if any stage it is found that he is fake, unreliable, immediately treatment is discontinued, one looks for batter one. God has given us wisdom and intellect to discern truth from falsehood. We spend years in education and learning to earn livelihood and respectable life. We have to make some effort to discover and earn eternal life, blessings and spiritual peace.
Take a bath, wear clean cloths, sit down alone and pray to God: “O, God of the universe, You are the Creator, Cherishes of all, You are Gracious and Merciful, I want to follow the right path which is pleasing to You, please help me, guide me to the Truth. Amen.
  1. Free your mind of all your existing beliefs & ideas.
  2. If you are a Christian, take Red or Blue lettered Gospels”, pen , marker and papers. Start reading Gospels, slowly, gradually, take your time, don’t be in hurry.
  3. Underline, highlight, note down the teachings, sayings of Jesus Christ what he physically and openly preached to people and 12 disciples, not in “VISIONS or Dreams”. [Thomas Jefferson’s Experience]
  4. Discard what is not common in four Gospels. Critically examine it, accept what is clear, obvious your are near to the Truth, discard any belief which is ambiguous, not clearly , openly preached by Jesus Christ.
  5. Look around for people who you find practicing closer to the real teachings of Jesus Christ. Seek their assistance.
  6. Continue with your quest for Truth till you find it. Keep praying to God for His help. Onus lies with Him.
  7. Keep exploring, keep reading ………. This site will assist in this regards.
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Why Monotheists be interested in Christianity and Bible? 


The three monotheistic religions, Jews, Christians & Muslims are linked  through the common ancestor and spiritual father of these great faiths, Abraham, the great monotheist. Muslims, also believe in the Biblical prophets and revelations to them from God hence closer to Jews and Christians. While Jews don’t believe in Jesus Christ, the Muslims revere Jesus Christ as a great prophet and messenger of God. While there are many differences, the main difference is the Christian doctrine of Trinity which according to many Biblical scholars is extra biblical.
However the least they can do is to to believe in Just One God, [not Trinity] the concept, always followed by Christians in varying numbers during last 2000 years, the number growing now. This may save them form idolatry, polytheism, the great unforgivable sin according to Bible (Exodus 34:14 ; Isaiah 2:8,
1Sa 15:23, Mt 6:24; Lu 16:13; Col 3:5; Eph 5:5, Acts 10:25 Acts 10:26, Revelation 22:8, 22:9) and Quran. Even seven laws of Noah which according to Jews if followed by gentiles are enough for their salvation, they include this great sin of worshipping any one beside God.(see Quran;4:116)
This site may help to follow the true teachings of Jesus Christ centred on obedience and worship of God. 
Explore more  about CHRIST & CHRISTIANITY: http://flip.it/0kFbY  
View my Flipboard Magazine.

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No Crucifixion – 31 Proofs, Evidence from Bible

The Salvation:
The salvation only comes through keeping of the commandments, was the teaching of Jesus Chrsit:

“And behold, one came up to him, saying, “Teacher, what good deed must I do, to have eternal life?” And he said to him, “Why do you ask me about what is good? One there is who is good. If you would enter life, keep the commandments.”(Mathew;19:16-17).

Paul nailed the Law and the Commandments to the cross: “having canceled the bond which stood against us with its legal demands; this he set aside, nailing it to the cross.”(Colossians;2:14).

Paul claimed that salvation can only be obtained through the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ:

“that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you shall be saved; for with the heart man believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation.”(Roman;10:9-10)

“If Christ be not risen from the dead, then our preaching is vain, and your faith is also vain.”(1Corinthians;15:14).

Jesus Christ never claimed to be God, he was a prophet, messenger of God for the Jews:
‘Men of Israel, listen to this: Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him, as you yourselves know.’ (Acts 2:22)
Jesus was not  God, it is proved through 90 verses from Bible:

Death of Jesus Christ on the Cross?
The death of Jesus Christ on the cross is the centre of all Christian theology. All Christian statements about God, about creation, about sin and death have their focal point in the crucified Christ. All Christian statements about history, about the church, about faith and sanctification, about the future and about hope stem from the crucified Christ.

Crucifixion or  Crucifiction-Video talk by Ahmed Deedat: 2:44

Jesus Not Killed-Internal Evidence of Bible:
Jesus Christ was neither killed nor was he crucified, as alleged by the Christian theologians and the Jews, but that he was alive.  The renowned South African scholar and authority on Bible, Ahmed Deedat in his book: ‘Crucifixion Or Cruci-Fiction’ has deliberated on this aspect through references and internal evidence from Bible. The salient points of his pragmatic arguments are summarized below:-

  1. Jesus was reluctant to die! Because he had worked out a strategy of defense to repel the Jews, because he wanted to remain Alive! (Matthew 26:37-38)
  2. He beseeched God for help: With strong crying and tears for God Almighty to keep him Alive!(Luke 22:44 Matthew 26: 37-39).
  3. God “Heard” his prayers: Which means that God accepted his prayers to keep him Alive! (Hebrews;5:7).
  4. An angel of God came to strengthen him: In the hope and belief that God will save him Alive!(Luk;22:43).
  5. Pilate (Roman ruler) finds Jesus not guilty! Good reason to keep Jesus Alive! (John;18:38).
  6. Pilate’s wife shown a dream in which she was told that: “No harm should come to this just man (Jesus).” In other words, that he should be saved Alive! (Matthew;27:19).
  7. Jesus was supposed to be on the cross for only three hours: According to the system in vogue, no man could die by crucifixion in such a short time which means that even if he was fastened to the cross — he was Alive!
  8. The other two — his “Crossmates” on their respective crosses were alive: So Jesus too, for the same period of time must be Alive!
  9. Encyclopedia Biblica under article “Cross”, column 960 says: “When the spear was thrust — Jesus was Alive!”

10. “Forthwith” Came there out blood and water: “Forthwith” means straightaway, immediately which was a sure sign that Jesus was Alive! (John;19:34).
11.  Legs of Jesus were not broken — as a fulfillment of prophecy (Psalm;34:20): “Legs” can be of any use only if Jesus was Alive! (John;19:33),(Matthew;13:14).
12.  Thunderstorm, earthquake, and darkening of the sun all within 3 hours! : (Divine help in acceptance of his prayer) to disperse the sadistic mob to enable his “secret disciples” to help, keep him ALIVE! (Matthew;12:49,Mark;15:47)
13.  Jews doubted his death: They suspected that he had escaped death on the cross — that he was Alive! (Matthew;27:62-64). The Jews were suspicious because it was all very “fishy”:
a.   The tomb within easy reach.
b.   Helping hands of his “secret” disciples.
c.   His “Crossmates” still alive.
d.   His legs not broken, whereas those of his “cross-mates” were!
e.   Quick and easy permission granted by Pilate to obtain the body of Jesus.
14.  For these and many more reasons, the Jews were suspicious. They felt that they had been cheated. Jesus was Alive! (?) So they ran to Pilate. But they had missed the bus again! They were 24 hours late (too late)!
15.  Pilate “marvels” to hear that Jesus was dead: He knew from experience that no man can die so soon by crucifixion. He suspected that Jesus was Alive!(Mark;15:44).
16.  Jesus was kept in a big roomy chamber (by his helpers): Close at hand, and big and airy for willing hands to come to the rescue. Providence was out to keep Jesus Alive!
17.  Stone (blocking entrance) and “winding sheets” had to be removed: Only necessary if Jesus was Alive!
18.  Report on winding sheets: German Scientists who carried out experiments on the “Shroud of Turin” said that the heart of Jesus had not stopped functioning — that he was Alive!
19.  Ever in disguise (as gardener)! : Disguise not necessary if Jesus was “resurrected” (spiritualized). Only necessary if he was Alive! (John;20:15), (Hebrews;9:27).
20. Jesus forbade Mary Magdalene to touch him: “Touch me not” for this reasons that it would hurt; because he was Alive! (Joh;20:17).
21.  Jesus said: “Not yet ascended unto my Father”: In the language of the Jews, in the idiom of the Jews, he was saying, “I am not dead yet”, in other words, “I am Alive!” (Joh;20:17).
22. Mary Magdalene was not afraid on recognizing Jesus: Because she had seen signs of life before. She was looking for a Jesus who was Alive!
23. Disciples petrified on seeing Jesus in the upper-room: All their knowledge about the “crucifixion” was from hearsay, therefore, they could not believe that Jesus was Alive! (Mark;16:11,13). (Acts; 2:24, Matthew; 6:30; 8:26; 74:37; 76:8; and Luke;72:28).
24. Jesus ate food again and again in his post ‘crucifixion’ appearances: Food was only necessary if he was Alive! (Luke;24:30).
25. Jesus never showed himself to his enemies: Because he had escaped death by the “skin of his teeth”. He was Alive!
26. Jesus took only short trips: Because he was not resurrected, not spiritualized, but Alive!
27.  Testimony of men around the tomb: “Why seek ye the living among the dead?” (Luke 24:4-5): That he is not dead, but alive!
28. Testimony of angels: “. . angels who had said that he was Alive!”(Luke;24:23). Did not say, “Resurrected” but the actual word uttered by the angels was “Alive!”
29. Mary Magdalene testifies: “. . . they heard that he was Alive, and had been seen by her, they believed not.”(Mark;16:11): Mary did not vouch for a spook, or ghost or spirit of Jesus but a ‘Live’ Jesus. What they could not believe was that the Master was Alive!
30. Dr. Primrose testifies: That the “water and the blood”, when Jesus was lanced on the side, was on account of an upset in the nervous vessels because of the scourging by staves. Which was a sure sign that Jesus was Alive!
31.  Jesus had himself foretold that his miracle will be the miracle of Jonah! “Then some of the scribes and Pharisees said to him (Jesus), “Teacher, we wish to see a sign (miracle) from you. But he answered them, “An evil and adulterous generation seeks for a sign; but no sign shall be given to it except the sign (miracle) of the prophet Jonah. For as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the whale, so will the Son of man (Jesus) be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.”(Mathew;38-40). According to the Book of Jonah, Jonah was Alive, when we expected him to be ‘Dead’; similarly when we expect Jesus to be DEAD, he should be Alive!
Was Christ Crucified?  [2:44] 
It’s a great debate recorded on video, between Sheikh Ahmed Deedat who is well-known as a Muslim scholar in comparative religion and Dr.Floyd E. Clark who is a professor emeritus at Johnson Bible College USA.

Jesus was not Crucified, but Raised Up:
The contradictions in the crucifiction and resurrection claims have also been mentioned in “Gospel of Jesus” according to disciple Barnabas, which are being mentioned here jus for information and additional knowledge:

  1. “..Then God seeing danger of his servant, commanded Gabriel, Michael, Rafael and Uriel, his ministers, to take Jesus out of the world. The holy angels came and took Jesus out by the window that looketh toward the South…” (Brnabas:215).
  2. “Judas truly did nothing else but cry out: ‘God, why hast thou forsaken me, seeing the malefactor hath escaped and I die unjustly?’ Verily I say that the voice, the face, and the person of Judas were so alike to Jesus, that his disciples and believers entirely believed that he was Jesus; wherefore some departed from the doctrine of Jesus; believing that Jesus had been a false prophet, and that by art magic he had done the miracles which he did: for Jesus had said that he should not die till near the end of the world; for that at that time he should be taken away from the world.” (Brnabas:217)

Hence the internal evidence from Bible conforms to the saying of God: “And (then Children of Israel) plotted and planned and God too planned and the best of planners is God.(Qur’an;3:54). “That they said (in boast) “We killed Jesus Christ the son of Mary the Apostle of God”; but they killed him not nor crucified him but so it was made to appear to them and those who differ therein are full of doubts with no (certain) knowledge but only conjecture to follow for of a surety they killed him not. Nay God raised him up unto Himself; and God is Exalted in Power Wise. (Qur’an;4:157,158).

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More Comments & Views
It is an absurd claim that an empty tomb proved that anyone was crucified, it merely proves that a body has disappeared. If Jesus was put at the cross he could have survived. According to Josephus a famous Jewish Historian of the First Century, it was not uncommon for Jews to linger on their crosses for sometimes up to 3 or 4 days till they would eventually die. Since Jesus was taken off his cross after only a few hours by Joseph of Arimathea this could have detected that Jesus was still alive, laid him in his walk-in tomb for an hour or two and returned with his men to remove Jesus from the tomb and mend his wound with the help of Nicodemus who had come with about 100 pounds of medications.
John 19:38-39
“After these things Joseph of Arimathea, being a disciple of Jesus, but a secret one for fear of the Jews, asked Pilate that he might take away the body of Jesus; and Pilate granted permission. So he came and took away His body. Nicodemus, who had first come to Him by night, also came, bringing a mixture of myrrh and aloes, about a hundred pounds weight.” [ http://ca.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20130724120536AAsO01K ]

Myrrhis the aromatic resin of a number of small, thorny tree species of the genus Commiphora, which is an essential oil termed an oleoresin. Myrrh resin is a natural gum. The oleo gum resins of a number of other Commiphora species are also used as perfumes, medicines (such as aromatic wound dressings), and incense ingredients.

Presently In pharmacy, myrrh is used as an antiseptic in mouthwashes, gargles, and toothpastes for prevention and treatment of gum disease. Myrrh is currently used in some liniments and healing salves that may be applied to abrasions and other minor skin ailments. Myrrh has also been recommended as an analgesic for toothaches, and can be used in liniment for bruises, aches, and sprains.

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Joseph of Arimathea
Joseph of Arimathea was a wealthy Jewish man who buried the body of Jesus Christ after the Crucifixion. There are many legends about him, including one that he visited Britain with the young Jesus, and another that after the Crucifixion he brought the Holy Grail to Glastonbury in Somerset and established the first Christian church there. keep reading >>> http://www.bbc.co.uk/thepassion/articles/joseph_of_arimathea.shtml

Did Jesus Die? 
This film investigates the variety of stories surrounding the New Testament account of the crucifixion, death, resurrection and ascension of Jesus, by interviewing historians, theologians and historical researchers. This exploration of the latest theories about what really happened to Jesus 2000 years ago uncovers some surprising possibilities.At the heart of the mystery is the suspicion that Jesus might not actually have died on the cross. The film concludes that it was perfectly possible to survive crucifixion in the 1st Century – there are records of people who did. http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/did-jesus-die/

How could Jesus have survived the crucifixion?
Is it possible, using the details given in the bible, that Jesus survived his crucifixion rather than rising from the dead?

1) Most crucifixions take days rather than hours.
2) The cause of crucifixion death is drowning in fluids that build up in the lungs. Could the spear wound from the soldier have released those fluids allowing survival (although causing an infection that caused death 30 days later?)
3) Jesus’ followers gave him a bitter substance (called “vinegar”) during the crucifixion. Could that have been a drug to ease the pain and caused Jesus to pass out? (If a friend of mine was thirsty, the last thing I would be giving him was vinegar!)
4) Jesus was only in the tomb for about 36 hours (Friday night to Sunday morning) well within the safety margin of surviving other forms of death like dehydration.
5) Could the cool, moist environment of his cave tomb have had a healing effect that allowed him to recover from his otherwise normally mortal wounds?
Source: http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100331084329AAQNF8U

Read More :
http://www.answering-christianity.com/abdullah_smith/jesus_survived_cross.htm

There is a range of evidence on the process of crucifixion in literature. blood loss may well have determined how long the victim would survive on the cross. …. The fact that Jesus Christ(as) did not carry his crossbar is given in support of this 

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